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The present podcast is part of Himal Southasian's 12-part podcast series Saffron Siege, produced in collaboration with Karwan-e-Mohabbat and originally published on Himal Southasian's podcast channel ( / @himalistan . This conversation took place on 19 September 2025 at the offices of the Centre for Equity Studies in Delhi and was moderated by its director, Harsh Mander, who is also founder of the Karwan-e-Mohabbat. The conversation started with some observations on the origins of the RSS before moving to a discussion of some of the views of its principal ideologues, including Golwalkar and Savarkar, and the role it has played in the political and public life of India. We discussed, in particular, the RSS view of the Muslim in India and anxieties, as Lal put it, about the proximity of the Muslim to the Hindu. Comparisons were drawn with Jews in Nazi Germany and the long history of anti-Semitism in Europe.