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From founding North America's first pediatric gender clinic in 1975 to being fired by activists in 2015 (and winning an $800,000 settlement), Dr. Ken Zucker has witnessed—and shaped—the entire evolution of gender medicine. In this remarkable conversation, the architect of gender dysphoria diagnoses in DSM-3R, 4, and 5 reveals how "gender identity disorder" became "gender dysphoria," why social transition flips desistance rates from 80% to 12%, and how activists "put the gender identity tail on the sexual orientation dog." His most striking revelation: Christina Olson's new data shows 88% of socially transitioned children persist—compared to only 12% persistence in his Toronto clinic. As Zucker observes: "When it comes to sex and gender, nowadays people stop thinking." From the paradox of homosexuality leaving the DSM while GID entered it, to WPATH's "talking out of both sides of their mouth" (claiming it's both natural diversity AND medically necessary), this is the insider account of how gender medicine transformed from careful assessment to "treatment on demand." About Dr. Kenneth Zucker Dr. Kenneth Zucker is a psychologist who directed the Gender Identity Service at Toronto's Centre for Addiction and Mental Health (CAMH) for 40 years until its controversial closure in 2015. He chaired the DSM-5 Sexual and Gender Identity Disorders work group and played key roles in DSM-3R and DSM-4 revisions. His clinic, established circa 1975, became arguably the first formal pediatric gender clinic in North America. He was also the first North American clinic to recommend hormonal suppression for some adolescents. After activists successfully lobbied for his dismissal, claiming he practiced "conversion therapy," Zucker sued and received approximately $800,000 in settlement plus a public apology. He has published extensively on gender dysphoria in children and adolescents. 🎧 Read the full show notes here: https://stellaomalley.substack.com/p/... 📌 CHAPTERS 00:00 – Trailer 00:58 – Kenneth Zucker’s career beginnings 04:45 – What gender dysphoria looked like before “affirmation” 08:12 – How parents shape a child’s identity 12:39 – The rise of affirmation-only care 16:21 – Why Zucker’s clinic was shut down 22:04 – What the data really say about desistance and persistence 28:16 – Are today’s cases different from the past? 34:20 – The role of social contagion 40:03 – Ethical care vs ideological capture 46:30 – Lessons from decades of clinical practice 🛑 Disclaimer: This episode is for educational and informational purposes only. It does not constitute medical or psychological advice. 🎧 Listen & Subscribe: 🔹 YouTube | 🔹 Substack | 🔹 Spotify | 🔹 Apple Podcasts ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 💬 What did you think of this episode? Let us know in the comments! 🔔 Subscribe so you don’t miss what’s coming next! 📢 If this episode made you think, share it with a friend! ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- #BeyondGender #KennethZucker #GenderDebate #EvidenceBasedCare #ChildPsychology #MedicalEthics