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It's often remarked that the age of New Atheism has passed. But what is emerging in its stead? In this wide-ranging conversation, Martin Shaw discusses, for the first time, his recent encounter with the figure of Jesus and steps towards a form of Christianity very different from his evangelical upbringing. Power and freedom, history and myths, the Inklings and the imagination are explored en route. And we ask what kind of Christianity might be evolving in our times. To find out more about Martin Shaw - https://drmartinshaw.com To find out more about Mark Vernon - https://www.markvernon.com To find out more about Malcolm Guite - https://malcolmguite.wordpress.com To find out more about Owen Barfield - https://www.markvernon.com/consciousness To find out more about The Temenos Academy - https://www.temenosacademy.org 0:00 Imagination and the Imaginal in the modern world 7:20 Different kinds of power: agency, allure, contraries 10:40 The revival of myth-telling but in the first person singular 15:30 Martin’s rediscovery of Christianity 21:40 The mossy face of Christ and what happened 34:04 People’s reactions to Jesus: contraction and expansion 39:04 Martin’s discovery of mystery in an Orthodox Church 46:27 What does this rediscovery of Christianity mean to him? 51:56 What does this mean for the “Christian curious”? 54:50 The shamanistic presence of Malcolm Guite 58:28 Mark’s journey in and around Christianity with Owen Barfield 1:05:25 A turn to William Blake 1:08:10 The transcendent possibility bubbling up again 1:12:57 The diversity of traditions and the entry of spirit