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Tom McCarthy joins us to discuss his new novel, "The Making of Incarnation," in conversation with Hal Foster. This program took place on Zoom. Bodies in motion. Birds, bees and bobsleighs. What is the force that moves the sun and other stars? Where’s our fucking airplane? What’s inside Box 808, and why does everybody want it? Deep within the archives of time-and-motion pioneer Lillian Gilbreth lies a secret. Famous for producing solid light-tracks that captured the path of workers’ movements, Gilbreth helped birth the era of mass observation and big data. Did she also, as her broken correspondence with a young Soviet physicist suggests, discover in her final days a ‘perfect’ movement, one that would ‘change everything’? An international hunt begins for the one box missing from her records, and we follow contemporary motion-capture consultant Mark Phocan, as well as his collaborators and shadowy antagonists, across geo-political fault lines and experimental zones: medical labs, CGI studios, military research centres . . . Places where the frontiers of potential – to cure, kill, understand or entertain – are constantly tested and refined. And all the while, work is underway on the blockbuster film Incarnation, an epic space tragedy. Commercial box-office fodder? Or a sublimely mythical exploration of the animation, contemplation and possession of flesh – ours and others’ traumatised, erotic, beautiful, obscene… Audacious and mesmeric, "The Making of Incarnation" weaves a set of stories one inside the other, rings within rings, a perpetual-motion machine. Tom McCarthy peers through the screen, or veil, of technological modernity to reveal the underlying historical and symbolic structures of human experience. Tom McCarthy is a novelist whose work has been translated into more than twenty languages and adapted for cinema, theatre and radio. His first novel, "Remainder," won the 2008 Believer Book Award; his third, "C," was a 2010 Booker Prize finalist, as was his fourth, "Satin Island," in 2015. McCarthy is also author of the study "Tintin and the Secret of Literature," and of the essay collection "Typewriters, Bombs, Jellyfish." He contributes regularly to publications such as The New York Times, The London Review of Books, Harper’s and Artforum. In 2013 he was awarded the inaugural Windham Campbell Prize for Fiction. He lives in Berlin. Hal Foster is the author of numerous books, including, mostly recently, "What Comes After Farce? Art and Criticism at a Time of Debacle" (Verso, 2020), and "Brutal Aesthetics" (Princeton University Press, 2020), his 2018 Mellon Lectures at the National Gallery in Washington. A member of the American Academy of Arts and Sciences, he teaches at Princeton University, co-edits the journal October, and contributes regularly to the London Review of Books and Artforum.