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This interview was recorded for the GOTO Book Club. #GOTOcon #GOTObookclub http://gotopia.tech/bookclub Read the full transcription of the interview here: https://gotopia.tech/episodes/387 Prof. Andreas Zeller - Faculty at CISPA Helmholtz Center for Information Security & Author of "The Debugging Book" @Andreas-Zeller Clare Sudbery - Independent Technical Coach @ClareSudberySSELtd RESOURCES Andreas https://bsky.app/profile/andreaszelle... https://mastodon.social/@AndreasZeller https://github.com/andreas-zeller / andreaszeller https://andreas-zeller.info Clare https://bsky.app/profile/claresudbery... / claresudbery / clare-sudbery-she-her-35939540 https://mastodon.social/@claresudbery https://www.madetech.com/podcast https://insimpleterms.blog Links https://www.debuggingbook.org https://github.com/uds-se/debuggingbook https://hub.2i2c.mybinder.org/user/ud... https://www.st.cs.uni-saarland.de/dd • Debugging Under Fire: Keep your Head when ... • Live Kubernetes Debugging with the Elastic... • Live-Coding a Dashboard with KSQL, Python ... • Building a Debugger • Sy Brand & Tim Misia... • Plain Text • Dylan Beattie • GOTO 2023 • (Guitar) Strings Attached: From UTF-8 to E... • How to Stop Testing & Break Your Code Base... • AI-Powered Bug Hunting • Ben Sadeghipour @... • Learning Test-Driven Development (TDD) • S... • What the Tech World Can Learn from Video G... DESCRIPTION Programming education has a critical blind spot: while we extensively teach code creation, we barely scratch the surface of testing and give almost no attention to debugging—despite debugging consuming half of all software development time. In this conversation with Clare Sudbery, Prof. Andreas Zeller argues that systematic debugging skills and modern automated debugging tools are the "ugly stepchild" of programming that nobody wants to discuss, yet debugging represents the biggest business risk and time sink in software development. As AI-driven coding becomes more prevalent, this gap will only widen, making investment in proper debugging education and tools not just beneficial but essential for the future of software development. TIMECODES 00:00 Intro 02:53 Revolutionizing tech education: The executable book format 11:17 What "The Debugging Book" teaches 16:01 Interactive debuggers & advanced techniques 21:31 Python as the language of choice 26:53 Tracking dependencies & Delta Debugging 34:55 Automated software repair & testing 51:09 Outro RECOMMENDED BOOKS Andreas Zeller • The Debugging Book • https://www.debuggingbook.org Sy Brand • Building a Debugger • https://amzn.to/4cWWr84 Charles Humble • Professional Skills for Software Engineers • https://www.conissaunce.com/professio... Cathy O'Neil • Weapons of Math Destruction • https://amzn.to/42jYkba Jonathan B. Rosenberg • How Debuggers Work • https://amzn.to/3SnFHgv Nora Sandler • Writing a C Compiler • https://amzn.to/3Z6SMhU Bjarne Stroustrup • Programming: Principles and Practice Using C++ • https://amzn.to/3I5Q335 https://bsky.app/profile/gotocon.com / gotocon / goto- / goto_con / gotoconferences #Debugging #Debugger #DeltaDebugging #StatisticalDebugging #Compiler #SoftwareRepair #SoftwareTesting #Testing #TDD #Refactoring #Python #TodayInTech #SoftwareDevelopment #SoftwareEngineering #Programming #AndreasZeller #ClareSudbery #BookClub CHANNEL MEMBERSHIP BONUS Join this channel to get early access to videos & other perks: / @goto- Looking for a unique learning experience? Attend the next GOTO conference near you! Get your ticket at https://gotopia.tech Sign up for updates and specials at https://gotopia.tech/newsletter SUBSCRIBE TO OUR CHANNEL - new videos posted almost daily. https://www.youtube.com/user/GotoConf...