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This conversation explores the life and theology of Julian of Norwich, a 14th-century mystic who lived through the Black Death. Tom Rundel discusses how Julian's experiences shaped her radical theology, emphasizing God's love and presence in suffering. The conversation also delves into the nature of God, the distinction between the world and God's kingdom, and the importance of radical inclusion in the Christian faith. Finally, it advocates for a shift from Christian nationalism to localism, encouraging deeper community engagement and awareness of God's presence in everyday life. takeaways Julian of Norwich lived through the Black Death, shaping her theology. Her visions emphasized God's love and presence in suffering. Julian's radical theology countered the belief in God's wrath during the plague. God's love is deeper than death, offering hope amidst suffering. The world is not separate from God's kingdom; we live in both. God's presence is often unrecognized due to societal power structures. Radical inclusion in God's family transcends race and status. Christian localism emphasizes community engagement and care. God's vulnerability is shown through proximity to humanity. The gospel addresses both spiritual and physical realities. Chapters Introduction to Julian of Norwich Julian's Life During the Black Death Visions and Revelations of Divine Love The Nature of God's Love Understanding the World and God's Presence The Power Structures of the World Radical Theology and Belonging Christian Localism and Community Engagement Find us on the WEB! - https://liminalliving.simplecast.com/