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Brent is joined by Michael Bervell, the founder and CEO of TestParty. We discuss the critical importance of digital product inclusion and accessibility in the ecommerce space. Many business owners are familiar with accessibility requirements in the physical world, like ramps for buildings or accessible bathroom, but often fail to realize that these same standards apply to their digital storefronts. Michael shares his unique journey into the world of product inclusion, stemming from his early experiences with consumer technology that wasn't built for everyone, to his academic background at Harvard, and finally to his current mission at TestParty. We discuss why accessibility isn't just a "nice-to-have" feature; it is a fundamental requirement that affects a significant portion of the population, including those with temporary or situational disabilities. As AI continues to change the way we build websites, we explore a significant issue: many LLMs are trained on existing, largely inaccessible web data, meaning they frequently output inaccessible code by default. Michael provides actionable advice for developer agencies on how to avoid these traps by using deterministic testing tools like Axe Core, Wave, and Accessibility Insights. We also discuss why "auditing" isn't enough. Many companies pay thousands for audits but never fix the underlying issues. Michael explains how TestParty is working to bridge that gap by building automated solutions that don't just find accessibility errors—they fix them. Beyond accessibility, we touch on Michael's book, "Unlocking Unicorns," which explores business lessons from founders in emerging economies like Asia, Africa, and the Middle East, and why the "leapfrogging" phenomenon is creating unique opportunities for innovation. Finally, we look at where the industry is heading, the unbundling of use cases, and how AI-powered automation will continue to optimize the back-office of ecommerce. Whether you are a developer, an agency owner, or an ecommerce brand manager, this conversation offers vital insights into building more inclusive, compliant, and successful digital products. Chapters 00:00 - Introduction 01:30 - Michael’s Bradbury Challenge and passion for reading 03:00 - What is Product Inclusion? 05:30 - Accessibility in the physical vs. digital world 08:00 - Understanding situational disabilities 11:00 - Navigating ADA compliance and legal risks 12:30 - Accessibility for developers: Are AI tools the problem? 14:45 - How TestParty automates accessibility fixes 17:45 - Lessons from "Unlocking Unicorns" and international business 22:30 - The future of ecommerce and AI innovations 26:00 - Shameless plug and closing thoughts This has been produced in cooperation with Content Cucumber / @contentcucumber7846 https://www.contentcucumber.com/ Follow Talk Commerce on your favorite platform: YouTube: / @talkcommerce Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/talkcommerce... Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast... Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7Alx6N7... Twitter: @talkingcommerce LinkedIn: / talk-commerce Facebook: / talkingcommerce Website: https://talk-commerce.com/