Douglas Jacoby & Thomas Ross Baptism & Salvation Debate part 1: "We are born again before baptism." скачать в хорошем качестве

Douglas Jacoby & Thomas Ross Baptism & Salvation Debate part 1: "We are born again before baptism."

Part 1 of 2 of the 2020 baptism and salvation debate between Douglas Jacoby (Campbellite / to Dr. Jacoby, the true Church of Christ) and Thomas Ross (independent Baptist, to Dr. Ross, the true Church of Christ). Learn more at: faithsaves.net/baptismal-regeneration/ In part 1, Thomas Ross is in the affirmative and Douglas Jacoby is in the negative, discussing the proposition: "We Are Born Again Before Baptism" (part 2 of the debate is "We are Born Again in Baptism" and Douglas Jacoby is in the affirmative and Thomas Ross in the negative). In this first debate, Thomas Ross argued that sinners are born again, receive eternal life, and are justified (declared righteous in the sight of God) before baptism at the moment that they repent and believe; salvation is by faith alone. He said: 1.) Scripture teaches all true believers are justified / spiritually alive. 2.) Scripture teaches that before being baptized, one must be a true believer. 3.) Therefore Scripture teaches that one is justified / spiritually alive before baptism. He presented over fifty passages of Scripture such as: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. . . . He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God" (John 3:16-18). Dr. Ross argued that when God employs words like “shall,” “will,” “every one,” “whosoever,” one who has believed on Christ has made at that moment the complete human response required to enter into eternal life. Baptism, therefore, cannot also be necessary for eternal life. Ross argued that saving faith is not simply knowing facts. In the words of the 2nd London Baptist Confession of Faith of 1689: "The principal acts of saving faith, have immediate relation to Christ, accepting, receiving, and resting upon him alone, for justification, sanctification, and eternal life." (Chapter 14, “Of Saving Faith.”) Ross pointed out that statements such as the following were not in the Bible: NOTJOHN 5:24: “Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and is baptized in the name of him that sent me (?), hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.” He quoted Thomas Campbell, a founder of the COC ("church of Campbell" if not the true church / if Thomas Ross is correct, "Church of Christ" if Douglas Jacoby is correct and his denomination is the true church) “Where the Bible speaks; we speak; where the Bible is silent, we are silent.” Thomas Ross argued that the Bible never says that the unbaptized will be damned, so we should be silent about that taking place. He argued that there is only one “everlasting gospel” (Revelation 14:6) and that in the Old Testament before the giving of the Law of Moses, underneath the Mosaic covenant, in Christ's ministry in the Gospels, in the book of Acts and all subsequent revelation, and thus in all of Scripture the lost were always justified at the moment of faith, quoting verses such as: "And [Abraham] believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness" (Genesis 15:6) “Kiss the Son [repent], lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.” (Psalm 2:12). He argued that the gospel of the Old Testament, salvation to all who trust in God’s Son (Psalm 2:12), is the gospel of the New Testament (Galatians 3:8, Hebrews 4:2). He also pointed out that many New Testament examples indicate that “thy faith hath saved thee” (Luke 7:50), that Gentiles are saved in Acts before baptism (Acts 10), the Apostle Paul was justified before baptism, that the Bible specifically says "whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God" (1 John 5:1), and contrasted baptism with the gospel: "Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel" (1 Corinthians 1:17). He argued that since salvation is not by works (Ephesians 2:8-9) and no law has ever been given that can give life (Galatians 3:21), the good work of baptism (Matthew 3:15) cannot save from sin. Dr. Douglas Jacoby responded to Thomas Ross's arguments and mainly made positive arguments for his position in part 2 of this debate (please also see that video). In part 1, Jacoby also argued that John 3:5; Titus 3:5; & Romans 6:3-4 teach baptism is the point of the new birth. He argued that baptism was considered the point of salvation to everyone in the early Christian centuries, quoting Justin Martyr, Theophilus of Antioch, Irenaeus, Clement of Alexandria, Tertullian, Novatian, Origen & Cyprian. He pointed out that he agreed with Thomas Ross that saying the "sinner's prayer" was not the way to be born again. Jacoby argued that baptism was not a good work and that passages condemning works salvation only spoke of Moses's Law. Please watch part 2 for more!