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I always love having Dr. Ryan with The Church Collective on the podcast. I appreciate the fact that he’s a deep thinker but doesn’t take himself too seriously. We both come to the table with a lot of ground under our feet while realizing we don’t have all the answers and still need to grow spiritually and vocationally. In this month’s conversation with Dr. Ryan, we explore the multifaceted role of worship leaders, emphasizing the importance of personal growth, intentional planning, and building relationships within the church community. We discussed the launch of Ryan's new podcast, www.formationtotransformation.com, which aims to deepen the understanding of worship beyond just singing. Our dialogue highlights the need for worship leaders to shepherd their congregations for the long haul, fostering a culture of discipleship and spiritual growth rather than just weekly musical moments. My prayer is that this episode encourages worship leaders to think about how they design and lead their congregations in worship.